General Chat

"God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference."

......and to know when not to reply on GR lol :-D

Good night and may your God go with you :-)

Ann - you're quite right - no responses as such in the free church. I can remember years ago, that the services used by Methodists, Baptists etc., were known rather irreverently, as a 'Hymn sandwich', a hymn - a reading - a hymn - a prayer - a hymn......sort of thing. There was no malice in that saying, it was simply a case of pointing out that those churches did not have an 'authorised' liturgy/pattern of worship (as do the C. of E. and R.C.), they could simply alter things as and when they wanted to.

Personally, I have grown to love a liturgical service. In life, with it's many ups and downs, I find comfort in the structure of the worship - it sort of balances me out!

Ruby, in the relatively new Anglican Book of Common Worship, the Apostles Creed uses the wording "He descended to the dead". I guess those who were responsible for modernising the service, felt that the word 'Hell' was out-of-date ?? :-S


As for speaking in tongues, I have heard it once in 'real time' so to speak. About 20 years ago, the vicar in our former parish took his bible study group to listen to another vicar who was the guest speaker at an Anglican church which had a reputation for being rather 'charismatic'.

The speaker was inspiring and, at one stage, various members of the congregation began to raise their arms and start 'speaking in tongues'. It didn't happen to me or to everyone who was there and some of those were disappointed.

Whilst I certainly do not deny the gift of Tongues, I think we have to be very careful how it is used. It should never, ever, be used to create a distinction that one person is 'a better Christian' than another. Each has their own God-given gifts and, if we ask, we are given the words to use on certain occasions, but not necessarily in Tongues. :-)


Rose.......a wonderful prayer and suitable for so many occasions. :-)

One advantage today is that we can shop round to find the right church or chapel for us. Most people prefer their local parish church or chapel, but you can stray further today.

My old chapel in Northants in 1990's was very Bible based, very strong on midweek teaching and very strong on prayer. And quite Calvinist (or reformed as they like to say). People would travel more than 60 miles each week (and still do).

I have moved twice since that chapel and my chapel in the Rhondda could not be more different. Very sociable, very easy going people. I do feel, as we get more into Christianity through our lives, that we know what we like in worship but also be prepared to sacrifice what we like sometimes to blend in.

When I went to a chapel yesterday in the Cynon Valley, I was told that a lady had died. Often I have no idea who they are talking about as the person has been ill for a few years and has not attended for some years. But in this case I knew the lady quite well and was very sad about her death. She was an educated and mild lady (a widow) who was life-long Church in Wales (C of E in Wales). But the local parish church was closed down about 4 years ago and, after much deliberation, she walked down the hill and joined the Methodists.

Last time I spoke to her, she said how pleased she was that she had attended Bethlehem these last few years. Worship was different, and she missed the responses and order of service. But she loved the singing and the free prayers and the "meaty" sermons.

Her funeral today. May God bless her and all her family.

Cynthia’s experience reminds me of an occasion when I was a teenager.

Our CoE Rector took us to a joint Ecumenical service held in a Pentecostal Church. It was led by various denominations Elders/Clergymen including him.

A member of the Congregation stood up and led a prayer. I can never forget the look of surprise on our Rectors’ face :-D

Re speaking in tongues and the Pentecostal church. Back in the late 70s my parents were most upset when our?their (I had moved away by then) Baptist church started to lean towards the pentecostal way of service. They never did come to terms with the change.

A Saturday smile for Cynthia.

The children of Israel wandered around the desert for 40 years. Even in biblical times, men wouldn't ask for directions.

Shane,

'There is, perhaps, no greater hardship at present inflicted on mankind in civilised and free countries than the necessity of listening to sermons.

No one but a preaching clergyman has, in these realms, the power of compelling audiences to sit silent, and be tormented. No one but a preaching clergyman can revel in platitudes, truisms, and untruisms, and yet receive, as his undisputed privilege, the same respectful demeanour as though words of impassioned eloquence, or persuasive logic, fell from his lips'.

(From Barchester Towers by Anthony Trollope).

Morning all,

The book I am reading at the moment is very interesting in the
fact that I have learnt some things i knew little of.

1....the Orthodox church is the oldest of all Christian churches,
I believe, sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

2....Russian Orthodox church biggest celebration is Pentecost
even bigger than the birth of Jesus.

The book is of Nicholas and Alexandra who i did not know
was of the Lutheran faith and had to enter into the Russian
Orthodox church before she married Nicholas. She was not happy
with this at the start but then embraced her new church.

Hope you don't mind me adding this to your thread but I found it
very interesting.

Emma

I was surprised to see this thread pop up again.....thought Sunday had come round early..... :-D


Budgie....... :-D Thank you for the smile - very much appreciated.


Dermot........... Trollope has a point which still exists today. Mind you, I wonder what he would have made of the Pentecostal style of worship? Do you remember the TV series from yonks ago? Donald Peasance played the lead role and it was the first time I remember seeing Alan Rickman.....he played Sloop? I've been a fan of his ever since.......he was so.......so.....obsequious!!! :-D


Emma.....of course you can add that on here. I've always had a certain fascination for the Orthodox church but my knowledge is sadly lacking - probably because I don't stop and find out enough. Sounds like a good read - keep us posted please. :-)


I was talking to my vicar the other day - poor chap is still reeling after the car business last week. He was warning me about forthcoming baptisms.....it seems as though we are fully booked until September and that includes baptisms at some point during every Sunday in May....... :-S :-S :-S :-S

My word, they breed well round here............... ;-)

Another Sunday and another baptism....... a little boy of about 18 months, all dressed up in a tiny grey suit. My word though, he was not a happy bunny at all and certainly let everyone know about it. I think he was probably very tired....... :-D


It was one of those occasions where the guests were obviously not very used to church going and didn't know whether to sit or stand. Fortunately, the retired clergyman who was helping out, gave lots of hints to help them along. It was nice to see some of them go to the altar for a blessing. :-)


It was surprising how many pre-schoolers were in today - considering it's a Bank Holiday weekend when lots of families like to go away for the day. They were very good and seemed happy enough.


Hope everyone else has had a good day.............. :-)

Elizabeth of the Seasons reminds us on another thread it is Rogation Sunday today. Was very grateful for all her info.

Emma. I found the info re these Eastern Orthodox churches to be fascinating. Will look forward to any pearls you find in rest of book :-)

Been out twice today - once to preach and once to home chapel to listen. This morning I had a congregation of about 90 and the singing was out of this world. Many of the congregation are of much higher social status than me - a Crown Court judge, two headmasters, several "professional" people. But I always feel welcome there, and I think we always have a good time. Had a minutes silence in prayers, and it really seems to have an impact.

Tonight they are having a Celtic style service. I have only ever led two of those, and I found them very challenging and very peaceful.

This afternoon we have had our top man (Superintendent Minister) and there were 20-25, which is quite a good congregation these days at my chapel. The main thrust of his message was to get out to people rather than expecting them to come to you. He mentioned the Apostle Peter going to the house in Capernaum of the Roman centurion - at a time when Jews did not mix with "unclean" Gentiles.

And he also mentioned the Apostle Paul visiting Lydia, the purple seller.

I thought it was powerful stuff for thought in these days. And all in all an excellent first day of my week.

I hope you have been blessed also :-) :-)

God’s Wisdom; Man’s Folly.

We will never fully understand
No matter how much we try,
God’s ways are outside our realm,
Along with the reasons ‘why’.

We analyse and intellectualise
What we do not understand,
We need God’s wisdom in our hearts,
Not the intellect of man.

I know we have so many questions,
But the answers we seldom find
For we can never work God out
Nor understand His mind.

There’s no searching God’s understanding
So infinite are His ways
New are His mercies and steadfast love
At the dawn of each new day.

So wonderful are all His counsels,
His wisdom’s too great for me,
He understands the whole universe
And the hurt inside, He sees.

I wonder how almighty God,
All knowing and divine,
How He could care about my world
And give undivided time.

But this is the complexity
Of the holy, great ‘I Am’,
We often do not fully grasp
And we fail to understand.

Just how much God really loves us,
Beyond what we can comprehend
For God is more than omnipotent,
He is our dearest friend.

(By M.S.Lowndes.)

Lovely words, Dermot. Thankyou for that :-) :-)

Thank you Dermot.

Cynthia...brings back memories of my 2 youngest grandchildren A & C's baptisms...both baptised on the same day.

Youngest A 18 month old slept through it all however the oldest C at 4 when his dad went to hold him up over the font and C not knowing what was happening cried out "I have already had a bath today"

The Church was in uproar :-D

C has his first Holy Communion in two weeks...I am holding my breathe :-D

Linda

:-D Linda :-D

That's lovely and I'm sure C will feel very important and all grown up at his Holy Communion service. Hope it all goes well Linda, and do let us know all about it :-)



The other day, I mentioned the late William Barclay, a British Theologian and Bible Scholar - much loved by many clergy. I find his style of prayers and thoughts very easy to follow and thought I would share the following with you:



A morning prayer:


Oh God our Father,
who commanded us to live in fellowship with one another,
keep us from everything which would make us difficult to live with today.

Help us never thoughtlessly or deliberately to speak in such a way that we would hurt another’s feelings, or wound another’s heart.

Keep us from all impatience, from all irritability,
and from a temper which is too quick.

Keep us from eyes which are focused to find fault and from a tongue which is tuned to criticize.

Keep us from being touchy,
and quick to take offence, and slow to forget it.

Help us not to be stubborn and obstinate,
and keep us from selfishness which can see nothing but its own point of view,
and which wants nothing but its own way.

Grant to us all through this day something of the grace and beauty which shone upon our Blessed Lord Jesus.

Hear this our prayer, for Your love’s sake,
Amen.


I hope everyone has a good week...... <3

Cynthia and John,

Not much more info regarding Russian Orthodox faith in the book
as it is mainly about Nichols11's reign and how unprepared he was.
mentions Gregory Rasputin and his hold over Alexandra's emotions
regarding her son's illness. The lead up of course to their murder and
what I have googled and read about the church very interesting, I
believe they were made Saints along with their servants apart from two
one being a Catholic and the other a Lutheran.
Some of their prayers are really beautiful and for various times of the day.

Emma

Thank you Emma - theirs was such a tragic story :-(


We had baptism prep tonight and I'm worn out!


There were eight baptism families along with several fractious children so, trying to put over the meaning of baptism, was quite hard.


We use a PowerPoint as a visual aid and talk them through not only the meaning of baptism, but the service itself. Many families are not used to church services so we try to makes things as easy as possible for them - without 'dumbing down' the faith.


One of the things we try to point out is that baptism is the beginning of the Christian journey - not just something to get over and done with.


I asked if anyone was prepared to say WHY they wanted their child baptised. There was a slight embarrassed pause and then one chap put his hand up and uttered those immortal words........"To have a party". sigh......


A bit later, the same chap asked for something to be done at the service and the Vicar explained that it wasn't possible and explained the reason why. The response from the man was "You're taking the ****".


Sometimes I think we could do with missionaries being sent to THIS country.... :-(

I was amazed to see a story of two African missionaries in South Wales 20 years ago. And they were in S Wales for missionary work amongst the "natives". My vague recollection was that they were employed by the Church in Wales (C of E in Wales).

Expect the man at baptism class was doing his best to lighten the mood. Wonder what reaction of other parents was to his comments. Hope his wife said something to him:-( :-(

My understanding of baptism is that the faith of one or both parents covers the infant against sin until the child is able to make his or her own decisions. So we do need to include these parents in our prayers. I do think it is a wonderful part of God's common grace that these folk are led to your church, Cynthia, given a nice welcome and an explanation of what baptism is all about. And prayed for as they and the Godparents attempt to bring the child up in the love of our Lord Jesus Christ. :-) :-)

I think the man was just being honest John.

It's easy to become quite cynical when you're involved in the C. of E. As it is the 'state' church, each parish priest has a duty of care to all those who live within his parish. Those people are entitled to use the church for 'occasional' services - baptisms etc., whether they are believers or not.

As for the man's wife well, I'm not sure about that - only a couple of the parents out of the eight families were actually married.


Looks like we have a different understand of about baptism though - I have never heard your explanation before, although I know there are some denominations who are against infant baptism and prefer to baptise adults.

In the C. of E. it is stated.......

In baptism, you as parents are: thanking God for his gift of life, making a decision to start your child on the journey of faith and asking for the Church's support.

For your child, baptism marks the start of a journey of faith, which involves turning away from all that is evil, turning towards Christ and becoming a member of the local and worldwide Christian family.

+++++++++++

As a godparent, you have a special role. It's about helping a child to come to know God, encouraging them in their spiritual life and supporting them in their membership of the local church.

You will be expected to be attend the child's baptism, where you will make promises to help to bring them up in the Christian faith.

It's a role that will develop over time, as your godchild grows up and develops their own faith.


If any parents feel that they cannot undertake the promises asked of them, they are offered a Services of Blessing for the child instead.