Genealogy Chat

Ann The term for death caused by untreated syphilis in the 19th century was always Grand Paralysis of the Insane, often abbreviated to GPI. If it just says paralysis, then it was just that - paralysis. People died of that in the 1900s because of poor nursing and neglect, which often led to pneumonia or stroke. I am quite surprised that ANYONE has a Death Cert with the dreaded word Syphilis on it - must have been a particularly brutal and uncaring Doctor, the shame would have been enough to make a family emigrate! Olde Crone

I just wanted to make that point that none of the people that have replied to my knowledge are doctors/experts so please don't be worried about anything that has put on here. As Old Crone says all women are secrelty tested when pregnant as the NHS/Government use the information to find out what the incidence of this and many other diseases in the general population and you would have been told if there was a problem. However if you just have a general interest perhaps you have found out more about your family's social history.

Paralysis Will generally mean a stroke if used as an unmodified term From http://www.paul_smith.doctors.org.uk/ArchaicMedicalTerms.htm which explains the terminology often used on historical certs. Liz

Thanks Nell, guess I'll never know for sure.

I like that, ''NEARLY a nun''!! Merry

Ann General paralysis of the insane was a euphemism for the final stages of syphilis. But paralysis could refer I suppose to a stroke (though more often it was called apoplexy). Its rather a vague term, really. nell

One of my rellies has the cause of death on his cert as 'paralysis'. I have been wondering how that actually killed you. Do you think it could be syphilis?

Ruth (You dont have to answer this) but if you are indeed worried that you may have congenital syphilis I can assure you that you dont have it. It is almost always immediately apparent at birth (it affects the shape of the skull and the postioning of the eyes). Since the advent of the National Health Service in 1948, every pregnant woman is routinely tested to see if she has syphilis and this still applies today. (They don't tell you they are testing for it, of course, because some women would be furious, so it is done as part of 'the blood tests'). You really have nothing to worry about, if you WERE worried - it would have shown up long before now. The effects died out with your GGM. If anyone is wondering how I know all this (LOL), its because I once temped at UCH in London, in the Archives and came across a book about syphilis, with lurid illustrations and photographs. It frightened the wits out of me and nearly made a Nun of me. Olde Crone

Ruth, Is this interest or are you concerned about what could have passed onto you?

Ruth Congenital syphilis in the mother does not mean she will pass it on to her children. The condition in her is the RESULT of her mother having active syphilis infection. However, congenital syphilis does, I believe, sometimes interfere with DNA and she might have passed 'imperfect' DNA to her children. I believe syphilis is only infectious in the primary stage. After that it remains dormant for many years, usually hiding in the spinal column for anything upto 40 years, and presumably making the sufferer think they have been miraculously cured by some quack medicine - there was no cure before the advent of M and B, in the 1940s. After that it gradually climbs the spinal column, paralysing as it goes, till it reaches the brain, which it also paralyses. This is why deaths from syphilis are always described as 'Grand Paralysis of the Insane' on death certs, to spare the feelings of relatives. Incidentally, syphilis was the fifth commonest cause of death in this country in, I think, 1998 - yep, 1998! Aids didnt even get a mention in the top 100 causes of death that year. Olde Crone

I think this depends on what stage you are at. Syphilis is a disease which can take decades to affect you but I think you are only infectious at certain stages. Perhaps you can find more info on a medical website, or in a text book. nell

Ruth this is a small passage from a web site about Syphilis... Who is at risk for syphilis? Anyone is at risk for syphilis during sexual contact with an infected person or a person whose syphilis status is not known. Babies born to infected women are also at risk. Georgina.

From my 'Bailliere's Nurses Dictionary' - Congenital - Applied to conditions existing at or before birth. - It does not mention if this is then able to be passed on. Ruth.

CONGENITAL suggests yes

Hi, my Great grandmother died of CONGENITAL SYPHILIS, aged 36 in 1919, at this time she had four children. I have googled and understand that she probably contracted this from her mother during pregnancy, does anyone know if she could have passed the congenital syphilis on to her children before her death.