Genealogy Chat

A lot of factory owners notably Fry and Cadbury who were quakers set up factory schools to give the children who were working a couple of hours schooling a day. Sunday schools also provided some teaching for poor children. I remember reading a biography of Ramsay McDonald the first labour primeminister who started work in the coalmines. He learnt his letters by writing in the coaldust. My own father born in 1918 learnt to write with slate and chalk. Maybe some people knew their letters but were not used to writing with a pen. I come from three generations of teachers. i rebelled. My greatgrandmother born 1840 trained as a governess and then when she married started her own school for her own girls and her neighbours children. Her boys were sent to boarding school. My grandmother went to the village school and then when she was 14 in 1896 she put her hair up and started teaching the infants. She took a teaching certificate by correspondence course and was qualified by the time she was 18. My mother took a two year teacher training certificate and got a job in a local infant school when she was twenty. The family were obviously keen on education. I have discovered a scholar aged six months. I have a couple of pictures of my grandmother with her class. Some of them look about two or three.

My gran was born in 1900 and we know that her parents paid for her and her older brother and sisters to go to school, and her dad was a miner so there will not have been money to spare.

Ragged Schools were set up in the early nineteenth century to give poor children a rudimentary education. These declined from the 1880s. Sunday Schools (for adults and children) taught reading of the Bible but not so much writing. There were no required qualifications for teachers and thus the quality of the education provided was variable. Often a schoolchiild would be taught reading for a year or two and then learn writing. If all someone had was two years' schooling, they would probably be able to write their name and a few other words, but their reading would be much better. I have agricultural labourers in 1871 who completed their own census forms; the phonetic spelling of the names gives it away as the enumerator copying what the householder had written.

Hello everyone I must say you're all very well read. Perhaps Genes could be set up as a school I'm sure they'd learn more on these threads for their history lessons than they do sometimes in their classrooms! Thanks for appeasing my curiousity. Its very stressful sometimes being so nosy!

Jennifer You ask whether or not this early education was different for boysand girls and the answer was very often yes, particularly in the agricultural areas where the boys left school at 10 to work on the land in whatever capacity was necessary, and the girls usually stayed on at school until 12/13 where they would learn dressmaking, housekeeping and general household duties to fit them for work as servants somewhere. It was not until Forsters Education Act of 1870 that the concept of Free Education came into being. However, many Manor Houses in the rural areas often provided the first schools which were often free, as it suited the wealthy landowners to have their workfolk educated to some level. In the towns the religious orders, particularly Catholics had schools from the 1840's onwards which were usully free, as they also wanted to have an educated Catholic commmunity as it was always in the best interests of Catholics to be educated to be able to get on in life in the UK. This happened in Ireland as well. Don't ever be fooled by the 'Mark'. As somebody has said previously they were asked to sign here with their mark and dutifully they did as they were told, and signed with a mark! This does NOT mean and never has meant, that they could not write their own names. We often mistakenly think that our forebears were illiterate, and this is not always the case. Janet

Laura I think it means they wanted the Enumerator to think the child attended school! Lots of people THOUGHT it was compulsory for their children to attend school. I have seen census entries where a child of 3 is supposedly a scholar. Funnily enough, this question has been exercising my mind lately. My GGF and his brothers were born in the 1860s, in a slum area (then) of Manchester. Their father was a drunk. But somehow, these three lads got an excellent education - enough for two of them to be apprenticed Merchant Clerks. All three did extremely well for themselves in life. I have been wondering how their mother (presumably) found the money to send them to school - I think it was 4 pence a week each then. And where the money came from for them to be apprenticed. Olde Crone

Just as a matter of interest, my first job, in the early 1970s, involved working for a town council in Yorkshire in contact with the public, who often had to sign documents. I was astonished at the number of elderly people who had to sign their name with a cross, even so recently.

I seem vaguesy to remember reading somewhere that Jane Austen was taught to read by her father and that when she first started writing books she had to give herself a mans name such was the feeling at the time that education was wasted on girls. Of course I could have dreamt all that!!

From the book of everything; 1870 The Education Act stipulated all children aged 5 to 10 years attend school,but it was not compulsory,and it was not free.Free schools started in 1891. By 1893 the children had to attend until the age of 11 by 1899 it was again raised to 12 years,the only exception was those who worked in agriculture. It wasn't until 1918 that the school day was organised fully,prior to that the day was arranged so they could hold down a job as well as attend school. Glen

I'm ith Merry on this,it was the late 1870's schooling was compulsory,but a charge was made so many didn't attend.Free schools started just in the 1890's. Interestingly though during the 1860's children who worked in factories were entitled to two hours of rudimentary education per day.This was a part of the workplace act brought in to protect women and children in the workplace. Glen

Education wasn't available free nationally until 1905. I think it was compulsory from about the 1870's (I'm awaiting correction on this!!)......many children only attended sporadically - imagine having to find the weekly sum when you might have five children of school age?! Children would not attend in the weeks their parents could not find the money, nor at harvest time, or any other time when work became more pressing than education......... There were always reasons to keep children out of school..... Merry

Thats interesting especially about the registrars. When my gr.gr grandfather got married, he signed his name and so did his father (born 1786) but his bride and her father just put their mark so I automatically assumed they couldn't read or write. Nice to know they may at least have been able to read. I'd hate to think I couldn't read - just imagine what you would miss out on

Jennifer When my son did the victorian era in school we found out a lot of info, one being that if the children were at school the parents had to pay for their schooling Julie

I can't accurately answer you Q, so won't attempt to do so, but thought you might be interested to know that many times the number of people who could write, could read..........Reading was something that could be picked up by most throughout their lives, whilst writing was something more specifically taught in childhood. Also many could write what they needed to.....for instance to do their job......but often when it came to signing their name on the marriage register, or whatever, they would be told to ''make their mark'' by the vicar, so that is what they would do!! Hubby's gg-granny chose to sign sometimes and X sometimes when she registered her children.....presume this was dependant on what the registrar asked her to do! Merry

Quite a number of my ancesters couldn't read or write but others could even in the same time frame. As they all came from good old working class stock it obviously wasn't that, that held them back. Does anyone know when attendance at school became compulsory and was it different for boys and girls? Just wondering