Genealogy Chat

When searching the 1881 census in GR for Alice Woodard, a correct entry appears showing her location as Lanchester. The transcription image shows her correct details. However, when you view the actual image, the head of the household, her father Joseph, is the last entry on the page - neither Alice nor the rest of the family appear. Am I missing something here or is there another way to view the next page which presumably shows the other family members?

On Ancestry you have the option of clicking on the next or previous page. You can't do this on GR.

Most researchers would say that buying credits or more than just the normal subscription for GR isn't worth it.

I will see if I can find your family and post the details.

Kath. x

Is this them? From Ancestry:

1881 England Census

Name: Alice Woodard
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: abt 1872
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Joseph Woodard
Mother's Name: Roosane Woodard
Gender: Female
Where born: Rockell ?, Suffolk, England

Civil parish: Esh
County/Island: Durham
Country: England

Street Address: 22 East Terrace

Occupation: Scholar

Registration district: Lanchester
Sub-registration district: Lanchester

Joseph Woodard 39
Roosane Woodard 37
George Woodard 16
Joseph Woodard 14
Robert Woodard 11
Alice Woodard 9
John Woodard 8
Roosane Woodard

Must be them, George is on previous page.
Jan

It's Joseph who is on the previous page - not George.

Kath. x

Kath,

I didn't know that - it's absolutely disgusting. It means that some images will never be viewable in GR. Something to consider upon subscription renewal! Many thanks.

Thanks brummiejan. That is certainly the family

Yes, it's Joseph, apologies -senior moment!
James, forget about 1881 being a factor in your membership on GR as it's free to view anyway! I think you might be able to access it on Ancestry without a membership but not 100% certain. Keep basic GR membership as you get such a lot of support, but look elsewhere for records would seem to be the consensus of opinion on here.
Jan

James

I think if you email GR they will send you the correct image.

Jan

You can only view the transcriptions for 1881 free on Ancestry and Findmypast, not the actual images.

Christine

I see - thanks for the info.
jan

You're sorted now, so this is for the next time it happens.

Each census page 1841-1901 is uniquely identifed. Usually, the identifier is a class #, (e.g., rg11), a piece # (e.g., 4946), a folio # (e.g., 136) & a page # (e.g., 96). These are often written as rg11/4946/136/96. From 1861 on, the class # identifies the census year. In 1841/51, the class # was ho107 - the low piece #s were 1841 and the higher #s 1851. A piece # would be a collection of enumeration districts in the same registration district. An RD would usually cover 3 or more pieces.

On the Monday after census night, each enumerator would go round his ED and pick up the forms, helping folk fill them in when necessary. He'ld get back to the office, copy them into his own book - thru 1901 the original forms got destroyed. All the enumerators' books in an RD would be collected by the superintendent registrar, and shipped off to the GRO for tabulation.

When the enumerators books were being filmed, they went thru all the books in a piece, and stamped the folio # on every other page with an increasing stamper, which got reset at the end of a piece.

So, on half the images, you can see the full identifier.
E.g., for wife Roosane, the PRO copyright slip in the margin has rg11/4946, and you can see the folio # 137 stamped next to the page 96 which was printed in the book.
For Joseph, all you get is rg11/4946/?/96


GR has a cruddy search - GR uses FindMyPast's transcriptions and images.
I've not used FMP for an 1841-1901 census, but anyone can do a free person search, and search by census ref. Now I can't get 1841 to work, but that's a special case anyways, so I can enter rg11/4946/137/97 and see most of the family there. The adjacent pages are rg11/4946/136/96 and rg11/4946/137/98 so I can change the page #, and if that gets no hits, change the folio # too. I see a list of names on that page (without a sub, I can't see details), but I can now look any of these names up in GR to link to that image.

You can also do a free search by census ref at Ancestry, but, unlike FMP, they allow incompletely specified census refs.
To get to do the search, you have to do an use advanced options under the "old search" style. I'ld also recommend checking the "exact matches only" box. The old/new style switch is under the main Ancestry menu bar, at top right - you might have to do a dumb census search for "John Smith" to get it to show up. NB Select the right census year data to search too.

There are two special years - 1841/81.
In 1841, the census ref has an extra element - the book #, right after the piece #. It appears on the PRO copyright slip.
In 1841, the image is of two consecutive pages, so one nearly always can read the full census ref of the right hand page from the image, so one knows the ref to look up - it's just I don't get FMP to work, whether cos it's broken or my incompetence, I don't know.
1881 is special too. Here Ancestry uses the LDS FS transcription, and they give the census ref for the head of the h/h, and then lie and give the same ref to the rest of the h/h, whichever page they're on. (Actually, it's that of who they claim is head - they get totally confused if the head claims she's the wife - which often happens in fishing villages when the head's at the fishing, or at least I see lots in Fraserburgh/Peterhead.)

However, in 1881, one can see the ref of the head at:
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=census/search_census.asp

If you get stuck with an image and can't get its full ref, I guess you'ld have to use Ancestry with an adjacent page specified to get a list of names to look up, and if they're not "Woodard"s, go thru them and getting their folio #s of their image, then using that folio # to see if you can find your initial page of hits, and if not, then crossing out the page of naames you'ld just gotten.
Really makes you think GR should give a paging button.

Or just ask someone on here to look it up!
jan

The next time that this happens,just ask someone for the next family.
I found this on Familysearch
John WALDON M Male 28 South Church, Durham, England Coal Miner

There is the image.

Thanks guys for all the help and advice. I have emailed GR about this issue - and I'm sure I won't have been the first to do so. It will be interesting to see their reply.

I think Jan got it spot on - GR may not be the most user-friendly search engine, but its community is unsurpassed!! Gold star to all the helpers out there!!

Jim

I agree with you James. I wouldn't be without my basic membership to Genes - just so that I can use the message boards. The help I've had on here in the past has been wonderful. However I wouldn't spend any more money upgrading my membership. I'd rather use Ancestry.

Kath. x