Find Ancestors

if you want to know how/whether he was related to you, is the simplest thing not to find out who his parents were?

Presumably you know the ancestry of the Cleaver your Hopper married ...

How on earth would anyone else know how Charles John Cleaver fits into your family tree without knowing who is in your family tree? :-S


unfortunately there seem to be two choices, both born Stockton


1861 census in Stockton

Stephen Cleaver 30
Esther Cleaver 29
John Cleaver 6
Charles Cleaver 4
Mary Ann Cleaver 6/12
William Barrott 21
Simon Rawbone 21

Births Mar 1856
CLEAVER Charles Warwick 6d 465


1871 in Offchurch

Richard Cleaver 60
Charlotte Cleaver 53
Charles J Cleaver 13
Jacob E Cleaver 8
Emma Cleaver 6

Births Sep 1856
Cleaver Charles Warwick 6d 411


so you may need his marriage certificate for his father's name, to sort it out

given the use of the middle name/initial, the latter one, here in 1861, may be more likely

Name: C John Cleaver
Age: 3
Estimated birth year: 1858
Relation: Son
Father's name: Richard Cleaver
Mother's name: Charlotte Cleaver
Where born: Stockton, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Stockton
County/Island: Warwickshire
Registration district: Southam

Richard Cleaver 51
Charlotte Cleaver 43
Jane Fell 10
Elizabeth Cleaver 7
C John Cleaver 3

but it's all guessing without certificates, and we know you won't be buying any :-D

the censuses are available free of charge at familysearch ... why do you not look at them?

Leamington Spa Courier - Saturday 03 October 1863

BANKRUPTCY ACT 1861

Jonathan Hopper of Long Itchington in the County of Warwick, tailor, having been adjudged Bankrupt under a petition of Adjudication of Brankruptcy, filed in the County Court of Warwickshire, holden at Southam on the twentyfourth day of September 1863 is hereby required to surrender himself to MR Edward Poole, a registrar of said court, at the First Meeting of Credotors to be held before said registrar on the 12th day of October 1863 at 11 o'clock

Is this your relative?

First name(s) Jonathan
Last name Hopper
Sex Male
Marital status Single
Residence Of This Parish
Marriage year 1835
Marriage date 03 Mar 1835
Marriage place Stockton
Spouse's first name(s) Sophia
Spouse's last name Cleaver
Spouse's sex Female
Spouse's marital status Single
Spouse's residence Of This Parish
County Warwickshire
Country England

He was an apprentice to the Hoppers I am related to and my hopper relative married into the cleaver family...

Thank you

Why do you think he might fit in Mark? If you give us all the relevant information, I'm sure someone will be able to help. :-)

I am still unclear how Charles John Cleaver 1858 fits into my family tree..

1881

Charles Cleaver
Age: 23
Estimated birth year: abt 1858
Relationship to Head: Head
Spouse: Mary E. Cleaver
Gender: Male
Where born: Stockton, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Leamington Priors
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Street address: 9 Victoria St
Marital Status: Married
Education:

Employment status:

View image
Occupation: Tailor
Registration district: Warwick
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3091
Folio: 156
Page Number: 43
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Cleaver 23 Slightly deaf
Mary E. Cleaver 21
Ernest A. Cleaver 4 months
Jonathan Atkins

With first wife in 1901

Charles J Cleaver
Age: 43
Estimated birth year: abt 1858
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Spouse: Mary E Cleaver
Birth Place: Stockton, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Leamington Priors
Search Photos: Search for 'Leamington Priors' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
Ecclesiastical parish: Leamington Priors All Saints
Town: Leamington
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Warwick
Sub-registration district: Leamington
ED, institution, or vessel: 04
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 2931
Folio: 82
Page Number: 15
Household schedule number: 107
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles J Cleaver 43
Mary E Cleaver 41
Ethel M Cleaver 18
Elsie T Bly 10
Ernest Pinner 15

Charles John Cleaver
Registration Year: 1907
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: Warwick
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Warwickshire
Volume: 6d
Page: 90[83]
Records on Page:
Name
Charles John Cleaver


Alice Maud M Thorn
Registration Year: 1907
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: Warwick
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Warwickshire
Volume: 6d
Page: 908
Records on Page:
Name
Alice Bennett
Charles Hinton
Alice Maud M Thorn

My problem at present is working out how Charles John Cleaver 1858 is related to my family

Thank you for this new information.

Coventry Evening Telegraph 01 March 1916

The Official Receiver has issued a summary of the debtor's statement of affairs in the matter of Charles John Cleaver, 3 Regent Grove, Leamington, tailor.
This shows gross liabilities amounting to £287 6s 5d of which £255 7s 5d is expected to rank. The last named sum also represents the estimated deficiency. Debtor gives as the cause of failure "Bad trade, and being afflicted with deafness."

Is this him in 1911? If so. it appears he decided to stick to the tailoring. He had been deaf since he was 5 years old which may go some way to explain why he did not appear to pay attention to his masters.
His wife had had 1 miscarriage, poor thing. I've not seen this on a census form before.





1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription

3 Regent Grove Leamington, Leamington, Warwickshire, England




Charles John Cleaver Head Married Male Tailor Cheifly Ladies 53 1858 Stockton Warwickshe
Alice Maude Mary Cleaver Wife Married Female - 40 1871 Leamington Warwickshe
Eric Cuthbert Cleaver Son - Male - 3 1908 -
Edna Daphne Cleaver Daughter - Female - 1 1910
William Horace Lingard Visitor Widower Male Actor And Theatrical Manufer 68 1843 Bristol
Beatrice Moreau Visitor Single Female Actress And Theatrical Managress 26 1885 Chicago
Sidney Francis Crowe Apprentice Single Male Apprentice Tailoring 18 1893 Harborne Birming
Reginald Alfred Barnett Apprentice Single Male Tailoring Apprentice 18 1893 Hungerford

William Lingard has put in the Infirmity column...None, Thank God!

Ah Cleaver was a relative

COPY PRINT SOURCE BOX SHARE
Attach to Family Tree
Jonathan Hopper
England and Wales Census, 1871
Name Jonathan Hopper
Event Type Census
Event Date 1871
Event Place Leamington, Warwickshire, England
Enumeration District 20
Gender Male
Age 56
Marital Status Married
Occupation Tailor
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Birth Year (Estimated) 1815
Birthplace Long Itchington, Warwicksh
Entry Number 24
Affiliate Image Identifier GBC/1871/3196/0185
HOUSEHOLD

ROLE

GENDER

AGE

BIRTHPLACE

Jonathan Hopper Head M 56 Long Itchington, Warwicksh
Sophia Hopper Wife F 54 Stockton, Warwicksh
John J Hopper Son M 19 Long Itchington, Warwicksh
Charlotte Hopper Daughter F 17 Long Itchington, Warwicksh
Henry Hopper Son M 15 Long Itchington, Warwicksh
Harriet Hopper Daughter F 9 Long Itchington, Warwicksh

What are you trying to find out?

'Charles John Cleaver, an apprentice to Jonathan and Edmund Hopper, tailors, was summoned for absenting himself unlawfully from the service of his employers, who claimed 3s 6d as compensation.'

Basically, Cleaver said he had not been trained properly and had not been given work so decided to go home. The Hoppers said he was a terrible apprentice who spent hours not working as he did not want to learn.

Upshot was Cleaver was fined 31s or 3 weeks in jail. He paid up!

this looks like the hooper's

COPY PRINT SOURCE BOX SHARE
Attach to Family Tree
Edmund Hopper
England and Wales Census, 1861
Name Edmund Hopper
County Warwickshire
Event Type Census
Event Date 1861
Event Place Long Itchington, Warwickshire, England
Registration District Southam
Residence Note Church Street
Gender Male
Age 17
Marital Status Unmarried
Occupation Tailor
Relationship to Head of Household Son
Birth Year (Estimated) 1844
Birthplace Gaydon, Warwickshire
Page Number 11
Registration Number RG09
Piece/Folio 2242 / 47
Affiliate Record Type Household
HOUSEHOLD

ROLE

GENDER

AGE

BIRTHPLACE

Jonathan Hopper Head M 46 ..., Warwickshire
Sophia Hopper Wife F 45 Stockton, Warwickshire
Daniel Hopper Son M 22 Gaydon, Warwickshire
Edmund Hopper Son M 17 Gaydon, Warwickshire

Afternoon folks

Any chance anyone could possibly locate the relevant articles relating what I have already found using genes..

Leamington Spa Courier Warwickshire, England

28 Mar 1874

LEAMINGTON

MrG. I’nett, Pbnninoton, and Capt. Hathbkell. A Tailor’s Case. —< karles John Cltmttr, an apprentice to Jonathan and Edmund Hopper, tailors, was summoned for abaenting himself unlawfully from the aervice of Ilia employers, who claimed 3s. fid. as co
View article Type: Article

Many thanks in advance